The Non-Negotiable Price of Impact - Part 2
Impact driven leaders never stay in the same place, but they always stay on the same path. Whenever we talk about patients, what do impact driven leaders always get concerned about? What do they always get worried about? What do they get anxious about? About?
Speaker 1:It's misappropriated anxiety, but it's anxiety nonetheless. I don't wanna get stagnant. I don't wanna get complacent. I don't just wanna stay where I'm at. That's not good, right?
Speaker 1:But what do impact driven leaders actually do? Well, if you're gonna make an impact, what do you have to do? You don't stay in the same place. I would never argue that you should stay in the same place because that is complacency. That is stagnancy.
Speaker 1:That is stultification. But what do you have to do? You have to stay on the same path. You gotta make sure that you're making deposits into the same account. You gotta make sure that you're chopping the same tree.
Speaker 1:You gotta make sure that you're moving in the same direction over an extended period of time. Well, hey there, I'm Alex Judd, the founder of Path for Growth, and this is the Path for Growth podcast. As a business, we exist to help impact driven leaders like you step into who they were created to be so that others benefit and God is glorified. Let's go. Well, we're on part two of this series on the non negotiable price of impact.
Speaker 1:And we always say that this podcast and this business being Path for Growth exists for impact driven leaders and that to be impact driven means that you're motivated by this crazy belief that you can make a difference. But in that, like we're talking not about impact driven people, we're talking about impact driven leaders. And so let's just remember that to be an impact driven leader, you are committing to making a difference within, through, and for other people. We say it all the time on this podcast in so many ways. When it comes to leadership, people are the point and you can't have leadership without relationship.
Speaker 1:And so it's in that that we've been asking a question about impact driven leadership. What's the price of making an impact? Because one of the kind of base level assertions that we're making and one of the undergirding beliefs that informs everything we do is that impact, the ability for you to make a difference on other people is incredibly valuable. And if it's incredibly valuable, then there's a cost associated with it. So the question that we are kind of asking is, well, what's the cost?
Speaker 1:What's the price of that impact? And as we've already articulated, there's so many ways that you could come at that question, but we're really focusing in and zeroing in on what I kind of have deemed as a non negotiable. That's right. I think what we're focusing on over the course of this series is a non negotiable price of impact. And that's why I think it's so crucial for us to spend time understanding the nature of this thing, really self reflecting and evaluating how do we hold this virtue or where do we need to grow in this virtue and ultimately finding and seeking ways to practice this virtue in our daily life and in our daily leadership.
Speaker 1:And so what is that non negotiable virtue? Well, the virtue that we've been discussing is the virtue of patience. And what did we say a formal definition of patience is? In episode one, we said patience is the capacity to tolerate challenges or delays without getting upset. And maybe even more than without getting upset, it's without hitting the eject button.
Speaker 1:It's without tapping out. It's without saying I'm done. It's the ability to endure. And if we were to really make that definition concise and portable, what is patience? It's being willing to wait.
Speaker 1:And so it's in that context that today, we're gonna look at principally what are some of the things that a patient leader knows. That if we are going to be leaders that practice patients personally and organizationally, what are the things that we principally have to keep in mind? And I think this is so critically important because regardless of where you are at in your personal life, my hope for you is that you have hopes of your own, that there's things that you desire, that there's things that you long for, that there's things that you're aiming at, that there's things that you're excited about, but that's not necessarily your present reality. Now this does not mean that you can't and shouldn't be content and joyful in your present reality. One of the things we wanna do is we wanna be deeply content while simultaneously pursuing being a leader that's outrageously growth oriented.
Speaker 1:And so we're gonna be content, we're gonna be present, we're gonna be grateful, but we're also gonna be excited and anticipatory for what's coming in the future. And it's in that that we are called to be people that wait. And we're not just called to be people that wait like we're slogging it out, that we're putting in our time or something like that, but rather we're called to be people that wait while exhibiting the fruit of the spirit. Love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self control. But But it's also a virtue that is undoubtedly required organizationally.
Speaker 1:Think about it. If you are in the game of developing leaders, what's that gonna take? Well, practically, it's gonna take time because it doesn't happen overnight. And if it's gonna take time, what's it gonna take from you specifically? Well, it's gonna take patience.
Speaker 1:If you're pursuing a long term vision to use Jim Collins' language, a big, hairy, audacious goal, if you're trying to build something that is truly bigger than yourself and beyond yourself, well, what's that gonna require? It's gonna require time and from you, it's going to require patience. If you are trying to bring about something that's innovative, that's new, that's creative to the marketplace, that you're gonna try and change people's perceptions, and you're gonna try to add value in new ways as an entrepreneur. Well, what's that gonna take? It's gonna take time, and because it's gonna take time, it's gonna take patience.
Speaker 1:And not just your willingness to wait, but the way you wait in many ways can have massive ramifications for whether that endeavor, that project, that relationship, that personal goal succeeds or fails. And so it's in that context that there's a few things that I think it's so crucial for us to reflect on and remember principally about the virtue of patience, and we're gonna walk through three of them. I'm gonna give them to you high level, and then we'll dive into each. I also wanna make sure that, if you haven't yet gotten on the email list to receive the growth guide, that you go ahead and do that because man, that growth guide is gonna lay out each of these principles. It's gonna lay out all the points that we discuss on this podcast.
Speaker 1:There will be application questions on there, and it's really gonna detail this entire patient series in a way that's really digestible, it's really shareable, but it's also organized in such a way that you can come back and reference this stuff later because maybe you're in a season right now that isn't requiring outrageous amounts of patients, but I guarantee you that if you're in leadership, your season is coming. And if that's the case, I wanna make sure you have this to be able to look back on your notes. So make sure you download the growth guide. If you're not yet on that email list, like, so many of you are, which is so cool, just make sure you click the link that's in the show notes to get on that list. Okay.
Speaker 1:Let's go ahead and jump into the three realities that we're gonna walk through. Number one, what do you need to understand? You need to understand the oppositional nature of first order and second and third order consequences. Number two, what do you need to understand? You need to understand the difference between productive and unproductive discomfort.
Speaker 1:That's where the growth guide is gonna be really helpful because we actually have a table that illustrates these differences in a really visual way. And then number three, the compounding value of staying on the same path. So this is what we're gonna break down, and the way I want you to be thinking about this is in an evaluative and a reflective way. Just think to yourself, man, do my actions in this season, in my life and leadership reflect that I understand this reality? Because that's what I really feel like I'm presenting to you today is just three realities that patient people and patient leaders understand.
Speaker 1:So let's go ahead and jump straight into number one. We said number one is patient leaders understand the oppositional nature of first order and second and third order consequences. Now the place that I probably learned this most comprehensively was from Ray Dalio's book, Principles, that is really just a a reference tool in so many ways for principles about life, business, and leadership that's incredibly valuable. But I pulled particularly the section that I learned this from, and I wanted to read it to you and then we'll dive into the examples. So here's what Ray Dalio says about this idea of first and second and third order consequences.
Speaker 1:Recognizing the higher level consequences nature optimizes for, I've come to see that people who overweigh the first order consequences of their decisions and ignore the effects of second and subsequent order consequences rarely reach their goals. This is because first order consequences often have opposite desirability from second order consequences, resulting in big mistakes in decision making. For example, the first order consequence of exercise, pain, and time spent are commonly considered undesirable, while the second order consequences, better health and more attractive appearance, are desirable. Similarly, food that tastes good is often bad for you and vice versa. Quite often, the first order consequences are the temptations that cost us what we really want, and sometimes they are the barriers that stand in our way.
Speaker 1:It's almost as though nature sorts us by throwing us trick choices that have both types of consequences and penalizing those who make their decisions on the basis of the first order consequences alone. By contrast, people who choose what they really want, what they deeply want, and avoid the temptations and get over the pains that drive them away from what they really want are much more likely to have successful lives. Now what's interesting about this is this is written from a secular viewpoint in many ways, but I think there's faith principles all over this thing. And what is something that we said in the first episode, what we said that patience is really related to and equated with and in the world cloud of the biblical ideas of humility, forbearance, self control, and faithfulness and endurance. And that's exactly what's being articulated here is what do we often see most clearly and most easily?
Speaker 1:Well, what we see is the first order consequence. In the example that he gave, right, we see and we viscerally and physically understand the first order consequence of going back to the gym for the first time. It's like, man, this is gonna hurt. I feel lazy and I don't wanna do this. I'm gonna be sore the next day.
Speaker 1:I haven't been there in a while and I don't feel good going to the gym whenever I haven't been in a while. And it's gonna require a ton of energy. I've gotta make time in my schedule. It's gonna feel clunky. And so we see that very viscerally, and we don't even just see it.
Speaker 1:We feel it. What we don't often see as viscerally or feel as viscerally is the second or third order consequences, because what are the second and third order consequences of going to the gym? Well, second order consequences are energy, momentum. And what's crazy is, I don't know if you feel the same way, but oftentimes, if I go to the gym, that's a healthy choice that promotes future healthy choices. Like when I go to the gym, you would think it's like, oh, now I'm gonna go splurge and eat whatever I want.
Speaker 1:But it's like, when I go to the gym, I actually eat healthier. And then what are the third order consequences? Well, over time, if you keep going to the gym, you're gonna be more healthy. You're gonna have more of a positive self image. You're gonna have more confidence.
Speaker 1:Right? And there's so many other third and even fourth order consequences associated with this, initial decision to go to the gym. But you see the oppositional nature. The first order consequence is discomfort, struggle, and inconvenience. And it's only if we have a vision of the second and third order consequences of this choice that we actually get to experience the benefit.
Speaker 1:And you see why that requires patience, because we gotta get over the hurdle of the first order in order to experience the second and third order. Now let's just think about the opposite scenario. If we decide to skip the gym, if we say, oh man, I'm tired, I've had a full day, I've been busy, right? I didn't sleep well last night. I just wanna stay home and have a cheeseburger, right?
Speaker 1:I'm not gonna go to the gym. First order consequence of that decision. The first order consequence of that decision is comfort, relaxation, convenience, and very practically a cheeseburger. So it actually feels pretty good. But what's interesting is in the same way, what's the oppositional nature of the second and third order consequence?
Speaker 1:Well, the second order consequence is gonna be almost a mirror image of the first order consequence. It's gonna be laziness. It's gonna be continuing to not going to the gym because lack of discipline begets lack of discipline. And it's gonna be poor eating, like we said, cheeseburger. And then the third order consequence, unhealth, poor self image, complacency creep.
Speaker 1:Right? Where it's like, man, we're complacent in this area. We've proven to ourselves that we are that type of person, and we start to see that creep into our marriage, our parenting, our work, all of it. Right? And we start, instead of becoming just complacent in this one area, we become complacent in other areas.
Speaker 1:You see how comfort on the front end results in detrimental consequences on the back end, Rather, discomfort on the front end results in health and growth on the back end. And we know that, yeah, practically that makes sense at the gym. But also I think we all kind of intuitively understand, man, this idea of first and second, third order consequences transcends our decision to go to the gym. So what's a parallel arena where this takes place? Well, let's talk about working in the business versus working on the business.
Speaker 1:In so many ways, I think for business leaders and business owners particularly, especially if you're in a business that you are the founder of that has grown over time, working on the business for you is like going to the gym. Because if you're the founder, it's like you built the business by working in the business, and now you know that what got you here isn't gonna get you there, so you need to do new things to get new results. However, it feels a lot like going to the gym for the first time. And why is that? Well, because the first order consequences of working on the business, what are they?
Speaker 1:It's thankless, right? In general, especially if you're doing this by yourself, which I wouldn't recommend, that's why our third fundamental is create a healthy and robust leadership team. But if you are doing it by yourself, right, like no one sees you doing it. And there's no one there to say, man, you did a great job. Thanks so much for doing that.
Speaker 1:Conversely, if you work in the business, everyone sees it. It's hidden. It feels clunky. It feels challenging, and it feels uncomfortable. Those are the first order consequences of thinking strategically, working on your business, starting to get process and focus and vision into your business, starting to make sure that you've got the structure to keep you where your growth takes you.
Speaker 1:First order consequences, thankless, hidden, clunky, challenging, uncomfortable. Now I hope you've got the growth guide because the way this lays out in the table is really visually helpful, I think. What are the second order consequences? Progress, rhythm, and momentum. We see it all the time, right?
Speaker 1:This is what we do with business owners is we help them establish rhythms and stay accountable to rhythms of not just working in their business, but working on their business. And for a particular stage of business owner, like, this is one of the primary value adds we and particularly our one on one coaches provide. And I see it all the time, right? When they're first doing it, it's hard. And oftentimes it takes a little while to get into the motions, right, to start going to the gym, to start exercising.
Speaker 1:They're figuring it out for the first time. But then they look up, and honestly, it's typically within like that first three months that they start to get some reps in, they start to get some deposits in, and they look up and they say, Oh my gosh, things are actually better. And certainly things are not all that they could be quite yet, and there may still be a little bit chaos and there may be a little bit of disorganization, but I'm starting to see progress. This is the equivalent of starting to see yourself lose weight. Right?
Speaker 1:It's like, I have hope that that our current reality, business that is chaos, disorganized, no one knows who reports to who, there's not clear flow of delegation, the leader is overburdened and overstressed. They they should have hope that it's like, I don't think it always has to be that way, and therefore, they start to get rhythm and momentum. But what's so cool is that's just the second order consequences. If they have patience and if they continue to follow through, what do they experience? Results?
Speaker 1:Like they start to just say like, oh my gosh, I got our cashflow report and it's the best it's ever been. We're more profitable than we've ever been. And decentralization, I have people on my team now that are making decisions actively and proactively that I used to make. Reduce stress for the leader, sustainable growth for the business that isn't all dependent on one leader. That's third order consequences of working on the business.
Speaker 1:But now, well, let's look at the opposite, working in the business. What does it feel like? It's familiar. You get recognition. You get a dopamine hit because you know exactly whenever you finish the thing, and you get credit.
Speaker 1:So it feels so good. That's a first order consequence, right? It's a positive first order consequence that's outrageously tempting. What are the second and third order consequences? Well, the second order consequences are stress, frustration, and firefighting.
Speaker 1:And sadly, people just experience these consequences. And if they haven't been exposed to other businesses where they see it operate differently, they just think that's the way that it is and that's the way it's always gonna be. And ultimately what that devolves into is lack of growth for the business, because if it's all contingent on one person working in the business, it will cap out eventually because that person is limited. Centralization, they're not building capacity, they're building dependency. And then finally, what is it?
Speaker 1:This is probably actually a fourth or fifth order consequence. A feeling from the owner typically that they're trapped, that they've built something that they don't even want anymore, but they have zero way to get out because it all depends on them. And that's really devastating, right? But you can see how this understanding of first, second, and third order consequences directly overlays to what we're talking about with patience. Because it's actually in the etymology of patience that it's directly tied to the word suffering, and it can be equated to the ability to tolerate pain.
Speaker 1:And so what does the patient leader do when they see an activity that they're like, I think that's the right thing to do. And why do I think that's the right thing to do? Whether it's to work on the business, whether it's to make that investment, whether it's to double down on a specific line of business, whether it's to innovate into a new area, whether it's to launch a new branch, they say, I think it's the right thing to do. And why do I think that it's the right thing to do? Well, it's this combination of intuition, but also successfully use clues.
Speaker 1:And I've seen other people operate in this area, and its mission and values align. It feels like the right thing to do. Well, what's the first order consequence of doing that thing? Often the first order consequence is discomfort. It feels clunky, it feels uncomfortable, it feels chaotic.
Speaker 1:But what does a patient leader do? They say, Ma'am, I'm gonna wade through the first order of consequences because I know that on the backside of that first order of consequences, if its mission and values align, are the second and third order consequences, and those are often the opposite of what I'm going to experience right off the bat. And this is wild to think about. Like, think about the things in your life that you avoid because they're uncomfortable, and then think to yourself, what are the second and third order consequences of those things? And this is actually an exercise in vision capturing and ultimately for yourself vision casting because oftentimes we're way better at seeing the discomfort associated with the first order than we are at seeing the pleasure and growth and service and impact that will eventually come if we endure to the second and third order.
Speaker 1:And so we're better at picturing the immediate, which makes sense, right? That's what we're most used to seeing. What are patient leaders good at? Man, they can envision, they can imagine, they can picture, hey, it's not gonna be the first order. The first order is gonna look very different than this.
Speaker 1:The immediate is going to feel very different than this, but they can get in their mind's eye. They can get this idea of like, but if I endure, if I continue on, I've got this image of how the second and third order will be directly oppositional to that. And in many ways, we're starting with the principle, but this is also a practice, right? That when you engage that practice, what are you gonna see expand? Your patience.
Speaker 1:Because you're not just waiting through discomfort for the sake of waiting through discomfort. You are now waiting through discomfort because you've got a vision of a hopeful, better, more impactful, more growth oriented future. So what do patient leaders know? They know the oppositional nature of first and second and third order consequences. That brings us to the second thing that patient leaders know.
Speaker 1:Patient leaders know and understand the difference between productive and unproductive discomfort. So we've already said this, and we've hit on this really quite a bit in this episode already. Patience is the capacity to tolerate challenges or delays without getting upset, right? And we really double down on this in the first thing that leaders understand. Patience is by nature uncomfortable.
Speaker 1:And really, if you're going to be patient, what we're talking about you being patient is being patient in everything being great and exactly how you want it for the remainder of time. No, that doesn't require any patience. What we're talking about here is I have these things that I'm anticipating. I have these things that I'm excited about. I have these things that I'm hoping for, that I want to see come to pass, but they're not here yet.
Speaker 1:My present isn't equated to my desired future, and so therefore I am called to be patient. But in that patience, there's a tension, there's a dissonance, and I feel uncomfortable. And we talk about it all the time that growth and comfort never coexist. So in some ways it's like, man, if I'm uncomfortable, there's a pretty good chance that that's right where I need to be because it's in that state of discomfort that there's potential for me to experience really life giving growth. But listen to how I said that real quick, because it's directly related to what the patient leader knows.
Speaker 1:It's when I'm experiencing discomfort that there's potential that I'm actually going to experience life giving growth. It's not a given. And that's what we've got to understand. Just because you're outrageously uncomfortable doesn't mean you're growing into the man, the woman, the leader, the Christ follower, the community member that you're uniquely called to be. And now we're getting into the thick of it.
Speaker 1:Now we're getting into the difference between productive and unproductive discomfort. And we could even maybe modify this and say there's productive and there's destructive discomfort. So maybe you're in a job that's uncomfortable. Maybe you've got a team member that isn't quite making it. Maybe you've got a business unit that isn't crushing it and isn't profitable yet.
Speaker 1:Maybe you've got a contract with a customer that just isn't flourishing and it hasn't flourished in a while. The question that's posed by all of these situations is, is this a type of discomfort that I need to be patient in and through? Or is this a type of discomfort that's really showing we're in the wrong lane and and we're not doing what we should be doing, right? In so many ways, this was a tension that I really wrestled with for a long time at my previous job, because I was a excitable, in some ways naive, really ambitious young person that I would get these grandiose ideas about, man, I need to leave this place. Because there would be things at my job that didn't totally align with my passions.
Speaker 1:That's a novel idea for a 20 year old to experience, right? They wouldn't totally align with my passions, and I would experience those things as discomfort, and I would kinda say, man, maybe I need to eject, maybe I need to leave, and, and man, there was one particular moment in time where it really, really came to a head, and I actually, like, was thinking, man, I, I think I need to leave. I I can't deal with this anymore. This is frustrating. This is irritating to me.
Speaker 1:I I think I need to leave. But the question that you've gotta ask is, man, is the discomfort that I'm feeling something that I'm actually called to be patient through, that I need to be willing to wait, that this is going to be used to flourish growth and opportunity in my life so I can be more equipped to serve others? Or is the discomfort that I'm experiencing like actually a sign that I'm in the wrong lane and I need to go pursue something different? I need to shut down that business unit. I need to fire that team member.
Speaker 1:We need to move on to a different strategy within the company. Right? And this is the tension. This is the question that is so hard. I talk to leaders all the time.
Speaker 1:A lot of time it's young leaders, sometimes it's old leaders too, that get tired of what they're in. And the question that they're ultimately asking is, man, is it actually that I need to continue on and persevere and exercise patience because there's great growth on the other side of this season? Or is all of these lagging indicators and all of this frustration and stress and tension and discomfort associated with the fact that it's like my time is done here, a season is changing and I need to leave. Really good question that oftentimes there's not a cookie cutter solution for, but there are some principles that you can overlay into that, that I've found incredibly helpful. And so again, there's a table in the growth guide that I think is really helpful because it makes this a visual, the difference and the distinction between productive and unproductive discomfort.
Speaker 1:Productive discomfort, the type of discomfort that you better hunker down, bear down, and focus because growth is happening, number one, it aligns with your mission and values. This is why it's so helpful for you to have personal mission and values and for your company to have mission and values because this is our first filter. The first thing we can ask is, man, we're not experiencing results here or this isn't going the way we want it to or this is really frustrating or this is really, really stressful, or this team member is really making us angry and upset. First thing we can ask is, does it align with our mission and values? And if it does, then well, we should probably continue moving down the list.
Speaker 1:But here's the deal, unproductive discomfort or destructive discomfort, it contradicts your mission and values. And so sometimes it becomes outrageously clear right off the bat. It's like, why is this business unit not working? Because it's not us. And so for us to be patient on something that's not us is a fool's errand.
Speaker 1:It's a bad strategy. We don't need to be patient in this area. We actually should have stopped it yesterday. We should have never started it, but the best opportunity to stop it is like right now. And so unproductive discomfort, it contradicts your mission and values.
Speaker 1:Now in my situation that I shared with you, the kind of personal story of, man, I'm getting frustrated. I think I can do more. I think I can do different. Not everything that I'm being asked to do aligns with my passions or what I'm really good at. And and would think about hitting the eject button.
Speaker 1:The first question that I had to ask, I was working at Ramsey Solutions at the time. Does it align with my mission and values? And the answer to that was unequivocally, without a shadow of a doubt, yes. Right? I looked at my personal mission.
Speaker 1:I looked at my personal values. And I would say, like, not only does it align, it's like hyper close alignment to my mission and values. And so in that case, I was like, okay, well, then I've gotta check the productive discomfort box and say that this, in that realm of criteria, this is an area that requires patience. Let's go to the second criteria. Productive discomfort.
Speaker 1:It's the type of discomfort you wanna endure through. You wanna be patient through. You wanna keep on. You wanna persevere. If there's opportunity for improvement of effort and results.
Speaker 1:So you got to really honestly ask yourself the question. I would encourage you to invite other people into this conversation that you know, like, and trust. Because the question that you've got to ask yourself is, is there opportunity for me to grow in terms of effort and in terms of the outcomes that I'm getting? And what we're really looking for here is there is there a space to grow? Is there is there the ability for me to move forward?
Speaker 1:Is there is there opportunity for me to be able to contribute more to other people in this spot that I'm at right now? And then the unproductive discomfort, the type of thing where it's like, man, this is not the type of thing you need to exercise patience on. This is the type of thing you need to leave is you've exhausted all opportunity for improvement. I can't increase the effort because I've got nothing else to give, and I don't see myself getting better results. Well, then that's probably a good sign that as it relates to that piece of criteria, this is not an area where more patience is going to help.
Speaker 1:In reality, more patience might just continue more of the same. And so think about this for an area of the business or with a team member that you're working with. Could you look at that team member that you're like thinking of firing because you're really irritated with them or things that just aren't happening or the thing that you hired them for isn't getting done? You gotta ask, do they align with your mission and values? And if the answer there is yes, then you gotta ask, is there opportunity for improvement of effort and results?
Speaker 1:And what I'm asking here is not really in them, although that's important for us to evaluate. What I'm asking here is there opportunity for increased effort and results from you? Like, have you done everything you can to try and make that work? Now, I'm not talking about taking responsibility for that person, but I am talking about the things that you're responsible to. And if you say, man, I think that there's things that I could do that I haven't done for this person and aligns with our mission and values, probably with wisdom, patience is warranted.
Speaker 1:And in my situation at Ramsey, I looked at it and I asked myself the question, is there opportunity for me to get better? Like I could work with greater sense of excellence, greater sense of diligence, greater sense of punctuality, greater sense of energy, better attitude. Could I get better at where I'm at right now? And the answer was yes. I was like, yes, I can.
Speaker 1:It's not like anyone's putting a lid on me. It's not like there are certain things I'm just completely blocked at doing. It'll require work on my part, but so does everything worthwhile. And so this is really helpful because this criteria keeps us from abandoning things just because we're experiencing the pain associated with patients. Sometimes it's like, man, we need to wait.
Speaker 1:We need to endure. We need to persevere. Okay. So let's go to the third criteria. So in the arena of productive discomfort.
Speaker 1:It's productive discomfort. Like it's probably a pretty good sign that you need to stay the course. You need to say this too shall pass, and you need to exercise patience if there's an absence of better alternatives. And particularly what we're focusing on here is better alternatives that are mission and value aligned. So if the place that you're at, whether it's the career that you're in, the team member that you've hired, the business idea that you're pursuing, if it aligns with your mission and values, if there's opportunity for improvement of effort and results, and there's an absence of better alternatives, meaning it's like, we look around and it's like, what else are you gonna do?
Speaker 1:Right? And that was the question, frankly, I had to ask myself whenever I was at Ramsey. It's like, okay, you're frustrated here. There's some things that you're like, oh, man, I could do better. I'm more passionate about some things.
Speaker 1:And there's some things that I'm really good at that I'm not able to do as part of my job right now. Maybe I need to leave. And it's like, okay, what are you gonna go do? Is a question that a mentor of mine asks me. It's like, well, I don't know.
Speaker 1:And it's like, well, until you figure out something better that's mission and value aligned, you probably don't have a reason to not just endure and persevere, especially if this thing is mission and value aligned. And this is really important in the business arena too, for us to ask ourselves the question of what is the alternative to my current course of action that's better? And oftentimes it's a sign that we need to endure if something is mission and value aligned if there's an opportunity for us to get better and there's an absence of better alternatives. Now with unproductive discomfort, well, it's probably unproductive for you to endure if you look up and you're like, there are like a billion ways that I could do this that are better than what I'm currently doing and their mission and values aligned. If that's the case, then in some ways we need to think about like, okay, well, unless there's something really particular where you're like, man, this is more mission and value aligned, this is what I'm called to, then you kind of just need to look up and pay attention and say, okay, this is probably a good sign that I don't have to exercise patience in this season.
Speaker 1:I probably need to go pursue one of those better alternatives unless there's something that I'm particularly called to about this place. But, you know, as I already illustrated, it's like in the season that I was in at Ramsey at that time, it's like there wasn't an abundance of better alternatives. Like, in many ways, the gig that I was in was the best gig that I could possibly have, not even just because of the current state of affairs, but because of all of the room for opportunity and growth. And so it it like helped me evaluate honestly and intentionally. Yes, there might be things that are frustrating, that are painful right now, but I'm called to endure.
Speaker 1:I'm called to be patient. And then finally, let's look at the final dichotomy. Productive discomfort, what does it do? It hurts. Unproductive discomfort harms.
Speaker 1:And what I'm really thinking about here is who's the man, the woman, the leader, the Christ follower, the community member that you're called to be? Productive discomfort, it's discomfort that hurts. Right? And and man, it'll make you sore. And it's like, man, I don't wanna be doing this right now.
Speaker 1:This is hard, but so is everything else that requires growth. And patience is equated to suffering. We've gotta remember that. But here's the thing. Is this the type of hurt that is going to make you into more of the man, the woman, the leader, the Christ follower, the community member that you are uniquely called to be?
Speaker 1:And if the answer is yes, then you're like, this hurts, but this too shall pass. I'm called to be patient. Unproductive discomfort, what does it do? It harms. And it makes you less of the person that you're called to be.
Speaker 1:And every day you stay is not an exercise in noble, God honoring patience. It's an exercise in self deprecation and emaciation in some ways. Right? You're becoming less of what you're supposed to be. And if that's the case, it's not patience that you're exercising.
Speaker 1:It's stupid persistence and, in many ways, stubbornness. And so let's think about productive discomfort. If there's something that you're in right now, whether it's a team member that you've got on your team, it's a job that's uncomfortable, it's, business unit that isn't quite hitting it right now, it's a contract with a customer that isn't flourishing. First question you gotta ask, does it align with my mission and value? Second question, is there opportunity for improvement of effort and results on my end?
Speaker 1:Third question, what are the alternatives? And then fourth question, is this hurt or harm? And I, again, wanna encourage you, download the growth guide because that really visually lays out this table in a way that makes it easy to see. But that's how we evaluate, and it's really getting clear on what are we talking about here. And man, I can just tell you from personal experience that it is so helpful to get clear on these questions and these particular criteria, because if you get clear on them, they're gonna give you the patience to be able to endure through discomfort that is actually productive.
Speaker 1:Because you're gonna see meaning in it. You're gonna understand, okay, this is actually connected to something bigger. And that was the case. In that particular season at Ramsey for me, it was about a year and a half in that that I was starting to experience the stress and ask those questions. And I have a couple of really good conversations that were very much rooted in these principles with mentors and leaders that I really respect, and it was taking an honest look in the mirror and saying, man, this is mission and values aligned.
Speaker 1:There's not better alternatives. There's opportunity for me to get better. And although it does hurt, it's not in any way harming me. In fact, I'm getting better every single day in front of the man, the leader, or the Christ follower that I'm called to be. And so it was like, this is a situation that calls for patience.
Speaker 1:If I didn't have those principles to lead on, I would have been guided by my emotions, and patient leaders are never guided by their emotions. Because the reality is is that your emotions experience that discomfort and say, we're out. We're done with this. But what's so cool is I stayed another almost three years after that. And over that course of that three years, I started coaching business leaders.
Speaker 1:And then from coaching business leaders, I started hosting and emceeing live events, which was just absolutely incredible and learning from all the speakers at those live events and learning about communication from people like the GOAT himself, Dave Ramsey. And then it was on the other side of that that I became the host of the EntreLeadership podcast and for a season got paid to interview people like John Maxwell, Jocko Willink, Marie Forleo. Right? Just a litany of really, really amazing leaders that I got to learn from on behalf of other people. And if I didn't have the patience to stick through that really challenging and stressful season, I would have never gotten to experience that.
Speaker 1:But then, as you know, if you're listening to this podcast, right, it was close to four and a half years in that I experienced a similar tension, although it was in a way healthier way. We've discussed it earlier on the podcast. And it was in that that I actually talked to people at Ramsey, and, and I also, talked to people in my personal life. And I said, man, does this align with my mission and values? The answer was still yes.
Speaker 1:Ramsey did align with my mission and values. Was there opportunity for improvement of effort and results? Yes. In many ways, there were opportunities for improvement, but I could also picture alternatives where there were opportunities for me to grow into more of the man that I was called to be. And that was really the distinction is that although these two paths both align with my mission and values, I could grow in each of them.
Speaker 1:Before, a year and a half in, there weren't very good alternatives. Like, what are you gonna go do? Well, nothing better than where I am right now. And then on the other side, it's like, man, not only is there something that I feel really called to, which is starting this business called Path for Growth. I think for me to stay here in this corporation where I'm not pursuing that would actually start to become harmful.
Speaker 1:Not because it was harmful me being there at that time, it was actually really good. I was thriving there and I loved working there in so many ways. But man, I could see every day that I spent not leaving to start this business was an opportunity where I could start to get bitter and resentful and not at anyone else, just at myself because I was sabotaging what I felt like I was actually called to do. And so in so many ways, that's what made the decision at that period of my life different than the one before. But you can see how it's like, man, it's productive discomfort versus unproductive discomfort.
Speaker 1:If I would have stayed four and a half years in and said, no, I mean, the opportunity is too good here, the salary is too predictable, there's too many things. I can tell you, I know people that have done that at other companies, right? And it does not go well with their soul. It becomes extremely unproductive and it's actually the opposite of patients. So what do patient leaders know?
Speaker 1:They know the oppositional nature of first and second and third order consequences, and they know the difference between productive and unproductive discomfort. Finally, what do patient leaders know? They know, they understand, they deeply believe in the compounding value of staying on the same path. I first illustrated this point at one of our in person experiences. It was one that we hosted in Asheville, and I'll never forget the room.
Speaker 1:It was the height of fall colors in Asheville, North Carolina, just absolutely gorgeous. This room was surrounded by windows. About 40 liters in the room. It's just such a powerful moment. And I asked the question to start the session.
Speaker 1:I said, what is something in the natural world that represents impact? I asked the question, and this was like something where I was like, when I was writing this content, I was like, I think people will get this, but I really hope they get it. Because in my mind, I'm thinking to myself, I live in Arizona, the obvious answer to that question, what is something in the natural world that represents impact? The obvious answer is Grand Canyon, but I'm like, I hope that it's as obvious to them as it is to me because otherwise this illustration is gonna be really hard to to shoehorn in here. So I asked the question, what is something in the natural world that represents impact?
Speaker 1:And without even pausing a moment, it didn't even skip a beat, it was like the first word that came out of his mouth, it was Herb Sargent, I'll never forget it. I was so grateful he was in the room that day because he wasn't prepped, he wasn't prime, he just said the Grand Canyon. I was like Herb, you're my dude, right? Thanks for being here. And so, yes, right?
Speaker 1:The Grand Canyon is a visual representation of impact that to such a degree that I ask that question and it's the first words that come out of someone's mouth in the room. Right? It's like when we think of impact and when we think of impact in God's creation, what do we think of? We think about the Grand Canyon. It's 6,000 feet deep at its deepest point.
Speaker 1:It's 18 miles wide at its widest point. Now think about how that impact was created for a second. Water moving in the same direction over time. How was the impact of 6,000 feet deep, 18 miles wide at its widest point? How was that impact created?
Speaker 1:Water moving in the same direction over time. Now, that's actually a really important reality to consider about creation that affects us as leaders because I think it directly applies to a principle that patient leaders deeply understand and believe. Impact driven leaders never stay in the same place, but they always stay on the same path. Whenever we talk about patients, what do impact driven leaders always get concerned about? What do they always get worried about?
Speaker 1:What do they get anxious about? It's misappropriated anxiety, but it's anxiety nonetheless. I don't wanna get stagnant. I don't wanna get complacent. I don't just wanna stay where I'm at.
Speaker 1:That's not good. Right? But what do impact driven leaders actually do? Well, if you're gonna make an impact, what do you have to do? You don't stay in the same place.
Speaker 1:I would never argue that you should stay in the same place because that is complacency, that is stagnancy, that is stultification. But what do you have to do? You have to stay on the same path. You gotta make sure that you're making deposits into the same account. You gotta make sure that you're chopping the same tree.
Speaker 1:You gotta make sure that you're moving in the same direction over an extended period of time. That's the question that we really have to consider if we wanna create impact over time. It's the question that we're gonna be really diving deeper into at our experience in Austin in October called Long Game Leadership is, what's the path that you are on, and how do you make sure you stay on it? And really, those two questions are gonna inform our next podcast episode in this series because we're gonna look at what does patients do. So impact driven leaders never stay in the same place, but they always stay on the same path.
Speaker 1:So the question I've got for you is what's the path you're on and how do you make sure you stay on it? And, man, we're gonna dive into five really practical actions
Speaker 2:of,
Speaker 1:like, making sure you know your path and making sure you stay on that path in the next episode. So I wanna make sure that you're subscribed to the podcast. And then, again, think about the three actions we talked about in the first episode of this series. Listen thoughtfully, reflect intentionally using the growth guide. You can click the link in the show notes if you don't yet have that downloaded.
Speaker 1:And then discuss it openly, right? It's so helpful to share this content, especially about patients with people because you can start turning that, okay? Because then you can ask each other questions and it doesn't just become this individualized isolated effort because healthy growth never occurs in isolation. And also, I'd be remiss not to say that all of this content is really foundational for me as I start to think about the whole curriculum of content we're gonna be sharing with a group of 45 leaders in Austin, Texas in October of twenty twenty five. The theme of that experience is going to be long game leadership.
Speaker 1:And the idea there is culturally today, man, we have such a high propensity to pursue things that are superficial, that are actually distractions, and that actually don't result in lasting impact over time. But what do we want to pursue? Well, we don't wanna play the short game, we wanna play the long game. And so we're gonna do a study, right? It's gonna be a study, it's gonna be in-depth, it's gonna be a jolt that moves us forward, expands our mind, expands our emotions around this idea of long game leadership.
Speaker 1:I'm so excited about the crew that's gonna be there. We've got 60% of the room all the way full already, and we're so many months out. We'd love to have you there if you're an impact driven leader that owns or runs a business. If you are interested in joining us in Austin, Texas, make sure you click the link that's in the show notes, and you can find out all the information at that link. Y'all know this.
Speaker 1:We're rooting for you. We're praying for you. We wanna see you win. Remember, my strength is not for me. Your strength is not for you.
Speaker 2:Our strength is for service. Let's go. Let's go. Let's
